Elinor Brown - The Art of Being Present, Creative, Generous & Introspective
Exploring faith journeys and inspiring ministries that embody the good news of God. This is the Cumberland Road. I'm your host, TJ Malinoski. The power of words are great building blocks to describe our situation, our circumstance, our faith. Today's guest thoughtfully shares her faith, weaving our conversation from the present to the past and to the future. Reverend Eleanor Brown is an ordained Cumberland Presbyterian minister who has spent much of her ministry serving in various capacities at the denominational level. Currently, she serves as the discipleship ministry team leader of the Ministry Council. In our conversation, Eleanor shares how her faith journey is becoming skilled in the art of being present, creative, generous, and introspective. Enjoy this episode of Cumberland Road with guest Eleanor Brown.
T.J.:Eleanor Brown, thank you for joining me. Take a few minutes and tell me who you are, what you're doing.
Eleanor:I'm Eleanor Brown. I've been Cumberland Presbyterian for all of my life. I am working for the discipleship ministry team now as the team leader and have a husband who's also an ordained minister, a daughter who's an elder in the church that we attend, and have a son-in-law and a granddaughter, which everybody teases me about talking about continuously, but I can't help it. She's great.
T.J.:Right. Right. A new member to the family. What would you want the world to know?
Eleanor:That's right. That's right.
T.J.:Yeah. You have served at the denominational level at some capacity for most of your life, right?
Eleanor:Yeah, since 1990. I did a little bit while I was in seminary. Mark and I traded jobs as the switchboard receptionist and as assistant to the Cumberland Presbyterian editor, so I'm not really counting that. Coming back from an associate pastor job in 1990, been with the Board of stewardship and with the discipleship ministry team all these years.
T.J.:Wow. And now you're the team leader. What role did you have before you were the team leader for the discipleship team?
Eleanor:I was the coordinator of stewardship education.
T.J.:That's right. That was Touch the Future days.
Eleanor:That that was actually when I was with the board of stewardship.
T.J.:Okay.
Eleanor:Future.
T.J.:Well, I should just be quiet and let you tell the chronology of No, no, no, that's fine. In
Eleanor:fact, I was thinking about the personal experience of God standing out in my life, and I have always, always well, I have talked about it in sermons before, and one of those times had to do with Touch the Future. I was going to the Cumberland Presbyterian Church of Germantown, where I attend now, and I was going to talk to the session about doing the discernment process for Touch the Future. And so what I usually did was come up with some sort of scripture and feeling led by the Holy Spirit about what that would be. And so before that before that meeting that I was gonna be having with them, I started thinking about it. I could remember I was ironing, which I don't do very often, so it was was one of those things.
Eleanor:And I started thinking about, you know, what is the scripture that I need to do? And all of a sudden, the scripture by the waters of Babylon, we laid down our harps, you know, how can we sing a song? All of that. And I thought, no, God. That is a terrible scripture.
Eleanor:You know? That is so depressing. I'm not gonna use that. I'm not gonna use it. But it kept coming back to me and coming back to me.
Eleanor:So I went on to work, and Davis Gray, who was the GA executive, was helping with the Touch the Future stuff. And so he I went down to his office, and I said, Davis, God is telling me to use this scripture. I don't wanna use it. I think it's, you know, depressing, and I don't wanna use it. I said, I don't even know where it is.
Eleanor:And he's and I said, do you know where it is? And he said, no. I can't think of right off the top of my head, you know, and he's a bible scholar, so I thought, well, if he didn't know where it is, I'm not gonna worry about it. I'm just gonna go to my go to discernment scripture, which is Psalm one thirty nine, Search me, O God, and discern my heart. So walked back down to my office, you know, trotting down, feeling smugly, I don't know what, but got down there, and I flipped my bible open to Psalm one thirty nine, and then casually looked over to the other page, by the waters of Babylon, we laid down our harps.
Eleanor:It was like, okay, God, I get it. It's right here. I'm going to use it. And so I planned planned that time, went to the session whenever whenever that night was. And it just so happened that there had been a storm that night.
Eleanor:Electricity went out at church. We decided to go ahead and have the meeting, but I couldn't do what I normally did, which, you know, entailed electricity, a projector, and computer, and that sort of thing. And so what we did was we just put a candle in the middle of the table and started talking about that scripture. And it was, of course, the perfect scripture because Germantown, right before we got there, had had a family, a big family leave the church, and they had been right on the edge of doing building and that sort of thing, and had to kind of pull back on all of that, and kind of left a sadness to the church. And so by the time we were doing this this discernment process, it was just things were getting back the church was getting back on its feet and and everything.
Eleanor:And so the session sat around the candle and talked about, yeah, we feel like we've been in in exile, and now it's time to go back to Jerusalem. And so that that holy that holy experience that whole experience was what I was gonna say before it didn't slip. It was a holy experience for me. It just, you know, was kind of one of those that couldn't couldn't help knowing that God was in the whole process.
T.J.:What and you couldn't avoid it either?
Eleanor:Oh, no. No. No. No. I don't think I was running away from it like like Jonah or anything like that, but but I do you know, it takes me a while to get a message sometimes, but usually I get it.
T.J.:Well, have you had any other experiences that have drawn you close to God, significant in your faith journey?
Eleanor:Well, I think that that everything that that has been a part of my life has been a faith journey. Sometimes I have reflected on my life growing up in in Tampa, Florida at Lewis Memorial Cumberland Presbyterian Church. I felt like I was I had made it when I finally could spell that as a kid, but I think that that time kind of started out the foundation for my faith journey. It was probably a little bit more of a conservative church than a conservative mindset than I would be now. But in talking with a young seminarian one time, I said, you know, I could be embarrassed by my experiences in the past, the, know, mistakes I've made or where I've come from, and that's not just with faith.
Eleanor:I mean, that's with with anything. But looking at those experiences, reflecting on those experiences have been the building blocks that bring me to where I am today. And so I have to be good with those things.
T.J.:And those are growth opportunities.
Eleanor:Always. Always. And, you know, I will probably be looking in ten years at myself now and going, wow, wonder why you were where you were. But that's all of us, I think, all of our lives.
T.J.:Yeah. I do that. I I look back and go, why did I worry about that?
Eleanor:Yeah.
T.J.:Why did that concern me or bother me?
Eleanor:Yeah.
T.J.:How embarrassing. You know? What were what were you thinking back then? It was no big deal. Yeah.
T.J.:But it felt like
Eleanor:it
T.J.:in
Eleanor:that When you're in the moment, it is a big deal. Talking about Touch the Future, the idea of taking that responsibility on, of creating something out of nothing, a discernment process, was a real struggle in my life trying to decide, can I do this? Do I have enough self confidence to even attempt creating something like that? And I I wasn't by myself. I had had great support, and Richard McGrill, who was my boss at that time, and as I said, Davis Gray, who helped with that, and a lot of other people.
T.J.:Yeah. Sometimes, I think people see things in us that we don't see in ourselves. Exactly. Kind of that gentle hand.
Eleanor:Yeah, and I think that that's probably always the way. I went to Bethel thinking that I was gonna be, well, that I was a music major, and that I would probably lead a choir, church choir, or, you know, do something like that. And then about halfway through my process, music major dropped and it's kinda like, Oh, need to reevaluate, God. What are you trying to say to me? And so ended up getting an English major, which I highly recommend to any seminary student to come to seminary with an English major, and that kind of changed my thinking about where I was going into the future.
T.J.:So much more than, you know, the local context of serving the local congregation through the music ministry?
Eleanor:Well, even even then, you know, coming under the care of Presbytery and thinking about, you know, what is it that I wanna do? I thought for a while, oh, maybe I'll become a hospital chaplain or whatever a lot of women ministers think alternatively rather than, you know, kind of a the normal going to serve as a senior pastor or whatnot. And very ironically, I became an associate pastor, and Mark became a chaplain, so hospital chaplain. So there you go.
T.J.:What words of encouragement would you give to a woman preparing for ministry to the word and the sacraments?
Eleanor:I guess I would I would say, especially if that if that person was in in a family situation or whatever, especially somebody once told me that, you know, when you're at home, you need to be at home and present, and when you need to be, I mean, when when you're at the church, you need to be fully present there. So I guess that's not just women ministers, but I think I think it it can speak to speak to any minister and to be confident about what you feel like you're being called to. I think there are a lot of women ministers who are in alternate ministries, air quotes around alternate, simply because there may or may not be opportunities out there in a church pastorate, but I've been really blessed, I think, myself to have people who have had confidence in me and have reached out and say, you know, we'd like for you to come serve here, and we'd like for you to come serve here. I know that's not the case with everybody, but being open to those leadings.
T.J.:Right. And then the layer of clergy couple adds to the fun in the dynamics of ministry.
Eleanor:Yeah. It adds the other layer of both people need to feel that call and have that call, and it's kind of a push pull sometimes, you know, thinking about when we were coming out of seminary, we were thinking, well, Mark will get a call to a pastor or whatever, and it was Tom Campbell who approached me as an associate, and and so having having that one that one job position and then saying, okay, how can we be creative in the in the other? Of course, that's that's the way it is with clergy couples, whether whether both are ordained or not. You know, one gets a call and one will need to find a position, whatever whatever that may be.
T.J.:Right. It's not exclusive, you're right, to clergy couples. It's a challenge for for any in a relationship.
Eleanor:Yeah. It does have it does have a lot of benefits that you don't feel like you are in this together, that you can talk about things. I think sometimes, you know, I laugh about when Mark would say something in Presbytery, I'd say, Now you know that everybody's going to think that you said that because I told you to say it. And if they know Mark and know the Browns, they know that that would not be true. But it's nice to feel like you have somebody that has your back like that.
T.J.:Yeah, there's pros and cons. I was sharing with a previous guest, Reverend Christopher Martin. He and his wife were ordained ministers. And so you have the language and sort of a general background where you can just slip in and go, this is what's happening.
Eleanor:Yeah.
T.J.:And then the con would be is is what you were referring to earlier of being present in the moment. Mhmm. At home, you focus on being home. Yeah. And then in the church life, focus on church life, and that can become a very gray area whether you're a clergy couple or not, but it would be like, okay, I'm trying to leave this at the door.
T.J.:Right. But there may be another congregation or another ministry that is separate that needs to be talked out loud about. Mhmm.
Eleanor:Yeah. Bringing, when when Mark and I both worked for the center when he was the editor of the CP Magazine, and I was working for the Board of Stewardship, a lot of times we would end up talking talking shop or or whatever you wanna call it, and, you know, have to kind of make make boundaries, set boundaries and say, you know, okay, we're at home. Let's talk family. Talk family stuff.
T.J.:And life and ministry has seasons sometimes. Has to roll over and, you know, things that need celebrating. Exactly. And then working things out that have to be worked out. Yeah.
T.J.:Right. Well, in terms of your service to the church and and your your faith, what is it about Christ and having a relationship with Christ? It it just keeps you grounded and centered.
Eleanor:Well, I think Christ gives me a purpose. I think that since I have chosen chosen ministry as a vocation, I think that that my faith that my faith keeps me keeps me grounded and and, again, feeling like I have someone that I could talk to about about my faith, about about my experiences in life, that there is somebody who acts as an example for me. You know, I talked about things building building up and found the foundation and those building blocks that, you know, get me where where I am today. I think one of those one of those things is is looking at Christ's life and Christ's death and resurrection and having that come alive in some ways. I remember when when our daughter Sydney was was first born, we were in Knoxville, you know, having that little baby in my arms and everything and thinking, God gave up this this little baby in in arms.
Eleanor:Mary and Joseph, you know, were stewards of Jesus' life and gave up this baby to be crucified for me. That impacted my life even more because I had the experience of being a parent and coming to the realization that that is the greatest gift in the world.
T.J.:Having that responsibility changes perspective. Yeah, but being able to let go changes the perspective as well as the child ages. Know, like, Oh, you know, that form of protection can only extend so far. That changes as well where it may move from physical to just verbal and encouragement, things like that.
Eleanor:Yeah. And I see that even more now when I see Sydney and Brian parenting Evelyn and, you know, being so proud of them and being, you know, being able to say, yeah, they got it. I don't need to, you know, tell them every little thing about every little thing. And if Sydney's listening, she said, Yeah, you could say that a lot less, you know, you could say it a lot less. But I think that giving up is is really, you know, it comes home when when you're thinking about faith and the whole idea of of Jesus' sacrifice for us.
T.J.:Yeah. It seems counterintuitive as from a parent parental perspective of of kinda giving up. Be like, No, no, you hang on tighter. Draw closer in. But it's very narrow to kind of think that way, I guess.
T.J.:It's not a benefit to you as the parent or or to the child.
Eleanor:Yeah. We were well, Sydney and I were talking the other day about about letting Evelyn cry a little bit at our she's getting used to sleeping at our house then too and, you know, so that she can have the big sleepover. And and so we were listening to her cry some and and, you know, I said, oh, it's hard. It was easier when I was doing it with you rather than with this granddaughter. And she said, you know, we're not doing any favors if we're not letting her self soothe, you know, because it's crying taking a nap right now, but it's gonna be, you know, other struggles she's gonna have to face, you know, in the future.
Eleanor:She's got to be able to deal with them. We've gotta help her do that.
T.J.:Well, speaking of parents, I'm gonna lead you into this question of, you know, individuals having a great impact on on your journey of faith. Mhmm. You know, your mom and dad very active in the church. And I remember spending the night at at their house. And your mom showed me this guest book of over the years all these individuals that have spent the night at their house and they've been very hospitable And they have had an impact on a great number of people from both denominations and beyond, of So I'm leading you into this question of who have been some people who have had a great impact on your journey of faith?
Eleanor:Well, of course they have, but let me talk about my mother's mother first, Faith Claytor. I think as a as a young person, she was somebody who really had a great impact. She was there in in Tampa with us, and so that was, you know, we saw her every week. Her life was that generosity and that hospitality, and I think that that was a good example for me. She was always at the Church Women United close closet every week.
Eleanor:She was making clothes for people. She was quilting for people. She would she had a green thumb, unlike me, and would bring a little, I don't know, a little posy or whatever, you know, a little a little bunch of of flowers wrapped up in, you know, wet paper towels and and foil or whatever to people at the church or to me or whatever. And I think that that that hospitality, that the importance of being at Vacation Bible School with us kids, all of those kinds of things, I think that hospitality and generosity go a long way toward giving me giving me that example. Of course, my folks in their hospitality, as you've mentioned to other people, They probably get tired of me saying to other people, oh, talk to my folks.
Eleanor:They'll be glad to have you and everything. But the truth is they enjoy that so so much, being able to experience people, especially who might be coming through from Columbia or wherever the people that they have have been able to become friends with over the years, especially especially people from from Columbia, missionaries, Beth and Boyce Wallace, the Stotts coming from Japan, and, you know, then then living there. But in addition to that hospitality, I think that their generosity is is something that that has really had an impact on me. They were brought up on on the farm and, you know, didn't didn't grow up in in a family with with a lot of money, a lot of possessions, and all of that. And, you know, that's that idea of stewardship, I think, has continued on with us.
Eleanor:Knowing about their planned giving, about writing a will, all of the estate planning, all of those kinds of things have an impact on us children. And so I think that that's been a great impact for us. Elsie Waddle, Doctor. Elsie Waddle, who was at Bethel when Mark and I were engaged, he did our premarital counseling, and we laugh about the fact that we're probably the only ones who did, like, a year's worth of premarital counseling simply because we had such a good time with him that we just kept mating and mating and he said, you know, when you get tired of this, then we'll stop. And, you know, we didn't.
Eleanor:We just it was a good way of being able to talk through a lot of different things even if it didn't necessarily have to do with our married lives. He was a good impact. And I guess, finally, Margaret McKee would be one that I would say had a had a great impact on me as an adult since that's when I knew her. The spiritual guidance that she has given so many people or had given so many people in the past, including me, being able to learn that, you know, there's not one way of praying. There's not one way of of doing things.
Eleanor:I think that that that kind of experiential meditation that has helped me so much, being able to sing tizay songs or go to a silent retreat or focusing on an object or whatever that is, guided meditations. I think that those those experiences for me through her have been really impactful and are still impactful. Those are some, you know, as as those places that I've seen God, those are a lot of the of the places I've seen seen God through through some of the things that she she taught me.
T.J.:One of the things that I admire about you is I can see in myself getting fast paced and wanting to run to the next project and complete this and that. And I've worked with you and I've observed and you have more of a laid back attitude and just kinda, well, hold on a minute. Take a deep breath and sort of I don't know, I don't wanna call it a slower approach, but maybe a more reserved and thoughtful approach instead of just plowing into something and see what happens.
Eleanor:It's totally fake. Oh, okay. No, I'm just kidding. Yeah, I think in a lot of ways that is the case. I'm an introvert, and so a lot of that has to do with, you know, being thoughtful about what's going on, what impact these things these things have.
Eleanor:I've read articles about it takes a little bit longer for introverts to process things because with an extrovert, they go straight to short memory and pick up pick up the information that they need, and so they could spit it right out. But with introverts, they go to long term memory and examine the the feelings and the emotions and all of that that that an experience involves or or gives you. And so it takes a little bit longer to go, yeah, that's I think that would be the way to go because because here's how it made me feel, here's how it made me think, and and whatnot. So so that is is there. I think sometimes it's it's, you know, a lot of just holding holding things in too.
Eleanor:I think that there there's the good and the bad. Mhmm. You know, the times that I've gone through depression and those those kinds of experiences, and people will comment to me, I didn't even know you were going through that. And that's a lot of of kind of keeping things to myself and being in my head thinking through things. On the flip side, you know, there's a lot to be said about keeping in your head sometimes.
Eleanor:You can entertain yourself and never be alone.
T.J.:Well, that's helpful. I know there's been settings where you and I have been together and was emotionally charged and look over at you and be like, well, man, look how reserved Eleanor is when when everything is just tense in the moment. I sort of admired that. But now that I've gotten inside your head, I look at it totally. No.
Eleanor:Well, another another thing is I think conflict is I wouldn't say it doesn't bother me, but I would say I I think it's healthy. I think a lot of times we, as Christians, will say, Oh, you can't have conflict, or whatever, because that's an unchristian thing to do. And I think that that's so many times the exact opposite. I remember an experience in seminary being in a class, and I don't know. There was something that just hadn't really jived in the class or whatever, gelled.
Eleanor:And so we got to a midterm or something like that, and it was just blowing everybody away. We were all looking at each other like, you know, here we haven't learned this stuff. And so, you know, I could tell everybody in the room was feeling that same way, but they weren't saying anything. It just looked like everybody was was getting more and more angry. And so finally, said to the professor, I said, you know, I think we're not in the same place.
Eleanor:And we began a discussion about, you know, we we hadn't really gotten what he was thought that he was giving us and whatnot. And it ended up where, you know, he very graciously said, okay, you know, give me back the test. We're going to start over. We're gonna start in a different way. And it was a great class.
Eleanor:It ended up being great class, but it was somebody in the room had to say, you know, this is not right. We've got to we've got to, you know, do something else. We've gotta start somewhere else. And so I I think usually if somebody will do that, then there can be good conversation, but you gotta you gotta be vulnerable enough to do that. And I'm not always the person that does that, but if I can be that person, a lot of times I will be Mhmm.
Eleanor:Because I know that it's important.
T.J.:As somebody who is very introspective, where do you see God working in your life
Eleanor:today? Well, first of all, not faith wise, but I would see God working in my granddaughter. Of course, I mentioned her three times or four or so, but I've lost count. But being able to experience remember I wrote on Facebook soon after she was born, Why didn't you grandparents tell me how good this was going to be and how wonderful I was going to feel? And Mark and I sometimes will look at each other and say, you know, gosh, we're so lucky that we have the best grandchild in the whole wide world, and the smartest and the prettiest and all of the, you know, it's great to have somebody who is feeling that exact same thing.
Eleanor:So that's a big deal in my life and having Sydney's family close by.
T.J.:There's something really humbling to be able to see the world through another person's eyes that, you know, through a baby or a child. And you end up learning so much because it's a different perspective where they may be, I'm looking down at the table, but they're looking up at the table. Right. And it's still the table, but it looks very different.
Eleanor:Yeah. And it gives you I think maybe that's one of the reasons why Jesus said, you know, you've got to come as a child, because being able to look at something so fresh and so new, you know, just makes you amazed, you know, being able to know that this is how our body works and this is how, you know, these cells work. It makes me think I can't believe everybody wouldn't be a Christian, wouldn't be a faithful believer in God creating the world and whatnot. So that's not in the faith or vocational area. I think one of the things that I feel really gifted with is such a good team to be able to work with, with Jody Rush and with Nathan Wheeler and Chris Fleming and Cindy Martin, Andy McClung, I think they will accept any challenge that I give them, even if it's a financial cash flow for what there's an event that they're doing or whatever.
Eleanor:They continue to amaze me when we have staff meetings and they bring some new idea to the table, it's just it's kind of like, oh my gosh. I can't, you know, believe believe that such good ideas are are coming forward. I've teased them about saying that I'm I'm the talent wrangler or talent coordinator. I just, you know, say, they'll come to me with something and then I'll say, Okay, how much is it gonna cost? And that's about, that's not all that that entails, but I think it's that's an amazement to me to be able to work with these people.
Eleanor:And, you know, of course, that extends to to the ministry council staff and everything.
T.J.:Our mutual friend and colleague, Johann Daza, he calls them fresh expressions. Mhmm. Being able to have these new ideas Yeah. These new visions and explore them. Called fresh expressions.
T.J.:I've always liked that.
Eleanor:Yeah. That's a that's a great way of
T.J.:Yeah. I always try to think up of something new, say it in his context, so that he'll go, that's a fresh expression.
Eleanor:Yeah. Yeah.
T.J.:But that God moving
Eleanor:Yeah.
T.J.:Through individuals or through groups and coming up with new ideas to do ministry or tailoring in existing ideas.
Eleanor:Yeah.
T.J.:Fresh expressions. I've always liked that.
Eleanor:Yeah. I like that, and and it makes it it makes some of the hardships or problems or or whatnot worth it to be able to say, okay. I feel like God is leading us in this in this direction. What what are gonna be the barriers? What are gonna be the things that are gonna trip us up?
T.J.:And That introspective Right. Part of Eleanor.
Eleanor:Right. Being able to to look at that, and and I love creativity, and being around people that are that are creative just is a wonderful thing. It makes me feel great.
T.J.:There's an energy around dreamers and explorers and excitement.
Eleanor:Is. Is.
T.J.:Admire those people that are able to kinda step out into the unknown. Yeah. They seem so brave.
Eleanor:Yeah. So I'll just I'll just stick with trying to trying to find the money for things and then just take all of the glory that they from from the ideas that they that they bring to us or or whatnot.
T.J.:Well, talking about the discipleship team and its ministries, let's expand that a little bit about the church that we both serve. What ideas, what hopes do you have for the Cumberland Presbyterian denomination?
Eleanor:I think that this is not a new one as far as I'm concerned. But I think it just it just comes to my mind over and over again as maybe as each new general assembly comes to comes comes around. And I think my hope for the church would be that we would let go of the things that society tells us we need to think about or other denominations tell us our measuring sticks that we need to think about. I think that we could use so much we could use our energy so much better if we were not trying to bring hot topics that divide us to the forefront and to instead focus on the things that that Jesus focused on. I was looking yesterday because of this question just kind of getting in my mind again what Jesus talked about the most.
Eleanor:And one of the things was money, and the other was the kingdom of God. And I think that that those those two things are the things we need to be focusing on. And when I when I save money, I realize that that's not just money, but what what money represents in in the parables Mhmm. Like the the woman who who gave gave all very quietly. It's it's not particularly about the money.
Eleanor:I mean, it is money that she was giving, but it was it was the attitude. And so I think that I think that if we were focusing on on the things, the poor, focusing on what makes this world the kingdom of God.
T.J.:Mhmm.
Eleanor:What fulfills the kingdom of God in our world.
T.J.:Earlier, we were before we started recording, you encompassed stewardship
Eleanor:Mhmm.
T.J.:Which included the money and the service. Right. And so a lot of those parables, the money is linchpin, but it's that stewardship of us as followers.
Eleanor:It's the attitude of being able to be generous with whatever we have. It's the idea of the recognition that, you know, this is God's world, God's creation. We can't just go around doing what we want and killing things that are that are a part of this world that really help us help us live.
T.J.:Mhmm. That would be an ongoing aspiration. Think as Right. As you said, it was a challenge for us as an entire denomination to grapple with all the time in measure Yeah. And say this is important.
T.J.:Yeah. Now this may be important, but later.
Eleanor:Yeah.
T.J.:Yeah.
Eleanor:How are we doing justice and and seeking kindness and walking humbly with our God? That's that's what I think we need to be focusing on. If we were focusing on those things, I think that I think that some of the other other things would just kind of fall away.
T.J.:That requires discernment. Does. It's almost those tools and those skills have to be built within kind of as we go as disciples.
Eleanor:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that that's I think if we were doing discernment, one of the things about discernment is it doesn't happen in a vacuum. It doesn't happen by one person.
Eleanor:Right. It's the community coming together and raising up raising up what what it is that we feel like God is calling us to do. One of the discipleship blueprints that I was working with was being able to talk to people in the in the pause program, a program of alternate studies, this past week we were teaching, and one of the things we talked about was how you go about setting up discipleship ministry team within your church and focusing on discerning what is it that God's calling us to do. Not what's God calling the big old church down the street to do, or God's calling us to a particular kind of children's ministry or something when we have is 65 year or older people. So I think that bringing people together and being able to say, What do we, as a community, think that God is calling us to do?
Eleanor:And then being able to focus on those things and do those things the best way we can. I think that that is when we will hear that voice saying, Well done, good and faithful servant, you know, when we're working in that way, and feeling energized by what's going on around us.
T.J.:Well, how can we continue to follow you on your faith journey? Where can we find you? What are you into?
Eleanor:Well, one of the things that I'm hoping to start at the beginning of the year is a new blog, and tentatively, it's called Good News Generosity. I recently became familiar with a blog or news article or whatever that told different ideas about, you know, good news things that have happened in the world. And as I was reading some of those, it became really clear these people are are not just doing something to do something or doing something to even serve, but it's that idea of generosity that has caused them to do to do what they're doing.
T.J.:Mhmm.
Eleanor:Because they've felt that conviction that they that they know that they have been blessed in many ways and want to, you know, kind of pay that forward and and bless others. So the blog is going to be on somehow taking that news article and kind of raising up the generosity aspect of So I hope that that's hope that that's going to be going to be done.
T.J.:Hope so. Yeah. More more forthcoming, I guess, as we get closer to the New Year.
Eleanor:Yes. Watch this space as Rachel Maddell says. Yeah.
T.J.:Alright. Anything else?
Eleanor:I don't I don't really think of anything. It's been a pleasure to to be here
T.J.:Yeah. Thank
Eleanor:you. And talk about these things.
T.J.:Thank you so much for sharing your faith journey
Eleanor:Thank you.
T.J.:And about your ministry and about your family and about your life. Thank you so much.
Eleanor:Thank you.
T.J.:And thank you for listening to today's podcast. Grab a friend and travel with us on our next journey down Cumberland Road.
